Spin in Table Tennis #271 | PingSkills

Spin in Table Tennis #271 | PingSkills

[Applause] take the game Terry Harris well at the basic level when there's no spin table tennis is a really nice simple sport because the target is close to you are your opponents in front of you and you're able to just tap the ball backwards and forwards nice and easily but as soon as you introduce spin the game has a devil in its tail thanks for joining us on the up the coach show this week our theme spin we've got all our usual segments so stay with us I hope you'll enjoy the show whatever I stay within us from other records Falls well all records sports you're talking about hitting the ball backwards and forwards but for me the real beauty of table tennis is spin okay and what's your favorite type of sphere ah for me topspin because it lets you belt the ball as hard as you want okay and when you remember first learning about spin I remember the first time I saw table tennis a very young age of five and seeing the ball spinning and coming back towards me and I thought oh my goodness that is just incredible Wow and a lot of people don't realize just how much speed you can get these days what's been the biggest contributing factor technology wise to make you are able to generate so much speed yeah definitely the table tennis rubber so having sponge and a grippy rubber on the top lets you generate a whole heap of spin much better than the old hard bats and I guess that was an 80 year old conviction young fit athletic types and not just some 80 year olds a lot of 80 year olds if you've ever been to a club and seeing some of those wily old characters they can just put a little bit of this spin and a little bit of that it makes the game very difficult to control now it's a bit of a success story and then some people think it takes away from the game so what are your opinions on technology and spin of this ever the game I love the game of table tennis as it is now but I also love the basic game of hardbat table tennis where it's all just pure and it's all about your athletic ability and being able to return the ball on the table here we've seen the World Table Tennis Championships where they only use the sandpaper pads making a bit of a comeback you think that's going to challenge the real game of table tennis I love it and wouldn't it be great if we had another form of table tennis in the fact in the form of hardbat or sandpaper or something where the game is standardized I think you would find a lot of player people in the world just coming out and having a look at this beautiful game so against will be kind of like Formula one versa you know a second class of racing he got real table tennis versus hard evidence um yeah is it Formula One versus in Australian v8 where the v8 is a car that everyone can drive whereas the Formula one is something that no one can really drive you know is it about the hard that being something that everyone can do and can relate to perhaps the game is certainly evolved from the days of the hard bat so now using sponge brothers so let's have a little chat about I deal with speed when you first get to a Table Tennis Club and people are putting spin on the ball it can be really bewildering so what do you need to know the first thing is you need to know the fact that that's what they're doing that they're spinning the ball for example they might put some side spin on the ball and the ball shooting off to the side they might put backspin on the ball and the balls going straight into the table on your side they might even put some topspin on the ball and the ball is shooting up off your racket so to a beginner going to a club that can be really confusing because it's hard to see what they're doing at the other end of the table but the ball is spinning wildly because the ball is one color with a bit of a label there you also don't get much information it just looks like a white ball coming at you and you just can't see the spin on the ball so alloys when a player does go to a club for the first time what are some tips they need to know about spin well why don't you go up and demonstrate a couple and let's try to explain it to the players okay [Applause] what's happening there is the first time Jeff did that spin I put my back to the ball and the ball was spinning off at and at right-angles almost to my bat because of the spin that was on the ball all I needed to do after that was just adjust the angle of my racket so by adjusting the angle of my racket then the ball ended up going in the right direction so initially it went out there by adjusting the angle of my racket it then started to go straight back on the table okay so that is interesting Ellis because it's all about just adjusting your angle to cope with the spin but I guess it gets tricky when they certainly spin the ball a different way it does and that's when again the game becomes more difficult so what you will try to do when you learn how to spin is that you're going to be able to do some different motions and get completely different spins but to the casual observer they actually look like they're the same thing and that's why this game is so great absolutely that's why you can take it to whatever level you want to it's time for the tip of the week and today Alice has a pretty bold claim no one can do the same serve to you ten times in a row where you won't be able to get it back by the tenth try allies that sounds like a big claim how do you back that up all you need to do is understand the principles of returning spin all right show me what you mean sure what you need to do find a good server and get that's me that'll be Jeff and get them to do the same serve to you over and over again our best tool a bucket of balls and now I'm going to get Jeff to return no I'm going to get him to serve a tomahawk serve so I'm going to see if I can return the tomahawk serve so again initially I told you I was a good server I wanted the best server so initially when Jeff does feeling a lot of pressure in there visually when Jeff does this serve and I don't react to it that's what's going to happen to the ball remember so what I'm going to do is I'm going to just change the angle of my racket a little bit to see if that helps why are you changing the angle because that's what the ball is doing the ball is reacting so it's hitting my bat and going off at that angle so what I need to do is I need to get that angle back around to here so that that is now facing towards the table so I'm going to adjust it a bit not quite but I was better so the first time it went over there the second time I was over there okay here we go I'm going to make a big adjustment second time all right I've got it on the table but it was bit edgy so now I'm going to try and get it right in the middle so it may be too much and it's going to go back that way a little bit hey I need a better server elegant alright so I think this is a really good idea if someone's struggling to return someone serve see they can get that person to serve that to them ten times in a row make small adjustments they should be good yeah this is easy is that absolutely but the problem is that sometimes then that will change up the serve and that's when it gets even trickier okay all right so there's some things to learn but you know that's a good tip will that person want to send that ball to you ten times in a row well you know if you nice to them if you are friends with them if you bribe them perhaps might be to go all right so yeah if you're struggling with a serve get someone to serve it to you ten times the exact same serve in a row and then you'll learn how to that serve and then as I said once I start making it up well then you're just going to have to keep developing recognizing those spins and you'll get better good luck [Applause] the drum of the week this week is the double-ended catch what is the double handed catch Alice oh this one's just for you Jeff because we know how much you like games so the rules of the double handed catch are that I've got to serve it and then you're going to return it but I need to do a double handed catch to get the point okay so it's a game yeah I'm up to whatever you want yeah okay so maybe you do ten says I'm going to do 11 serves okay I'm going to do 11 serves and out of those 11 I'm going to see how many times I can serve it Jeff returns it and I do a double handed catch if Jeff misses the return I also get a point yeah unlikely but what what's the point of this why a double handed tax okay what that does is firstly it puts a bit of pressure on the receiver so the receiver is now trying to make a better return it puts pressure on me as the server to do a better serve that the receiver can't play fast and then lastly it gets me into a good position to do the double handed catch which means that if I was playing the next shot I'd be in a good position to play a strong shot okay sounds like a fun drill let's give it a go it is fun but you're going down one for me is chalk up another one three-nil do I have to turn mine over for him Jeff you were clearly no good at returning maybe we should change roles yeah I guess I should have a go but what I picked up from the receiving side is that it's difficult if you do a short fall for me to hit it hard enough for you to attack it and when you play a long fast one yeah then you're in trouble because I can hit it harder but also I mean you did win a few surprisingly with a long fast serve as well yeah exactly as an element of surprise I've got away with it the first time I served that long and fast but the second time I served that long and it was a bit high into his forehand I was in big trouble okay so yes this is a really good exercise to you just work on effective serving absolutely give it a try sure one nil [Applause] [Applause] let flat well alloys she certainly surprised me a few times there with some really aggressive returned surprise was the element so I played this game before so I know that making safe returns just isn't going to cut it so I went out pretty hard at the return to try to win some of those points and if you think about it most of the time odds are in the server's favor so especially if you're playing against in good server perhaps just having having a go at those and taking a few more risks might be the go yeah good advice well I certainly enjoyed that drill get out on the table I have a practice of this specific drill and I'm sure you'll start to improve your serve and you return learn more about spin give it a go you won't regret it remember me this week we're going back over 60 years I found this really interesting and I hope you do too it was 1952 and the game of table tennis was about to change the Japanese scientists had been working in the back rooms inventing something very very sinister at the World Championships in Bombay India they unveiled this sinister new weapon they gave the weapon to Japanese player hero-ji Sato who definitely wasn't the best table tennis player in the world in fact some players described him as you know just a bit knock-kneed and they couldn't really even understand why he was in the team but things were about to change with the sponge rubber he went out and then was able to win the world singles championships three mil in the final and changed the game Table Tennis as we know it today here oh gee thought of Japan was not lost a single match since of the rival in Bombay created history by becoming the men's singles champion of the world in his very first attempt he won in three straight games against Joseph Cote on of Hungary he was more surprised than anyone else when he found himself the world singles champion and he was received by a million people they say who lined the streets of Tokyo to greet back their first world champion not only in table tennis but in any athletic sport everything well a louis that was really interesting to see here OG playing winning the world chairmanships what surprised me was that he wasn't very aggressive with that sponge rubber he was almost going back and chopping real he wasn't it all my visions of what I thought would happen was that you know he'd be out there and doing these top spins for the first time with with the sponge rubber but yes just the subtle variation with the the spin that was coming from the sponge really threw everyone in the world yeah and I guess what was really different was just the sound that sponge was almost like no sound so people just weren't used to that and I guess that threw off their senses a lot yeah and sound is such an important part of our game and when you hear the hard bats playing I think that's one of the really appealing things about it too and just the rhythm of that attack attack attack whereas suddenly hiroji Satoh appears with a bat that isn't making any sound that would have really thrown his opponents off as well yeah and I guess we have to remember it wasn't a sponge bat like we play with today I wasn't you know this super grippy so yeah you know technology evolves I guess slowly is one way to put it yeah and it wasn't even the rubber on the surface it was almost like if you take the rubber off the top and you've just got the sponge you know when you when you rip off the rubber off those cheap bats and it's got a layer of sponge but this was just a bit thicker so with that just being able to spin the ball change the timing change the sound of the game world champion there you go what a great trip down memory lane it's only a couple of weeks away now so for the tournament wrap this week we're going to talk about the Olympic Games alloys the ITTF have released the confirmed players rankings list as of July 14th so at least the rankings of everyone is qualified for the Olympic Games anything interesting pop out to you well firstly the fact that they released that list because they're not going to take the figures from this list officially the official date is the first of August but the thing is that there's not going to be any tournaments between now and the 1st of August so I think we could almost take this list as the ceilings for the Olympics Wow very interesting Lee and I guess no surprises Malang in at number 1 in the men's and deaning for the women absolutely so the two Chinese players in the men's mile long and Zheng Jie Kerr head up the list and ranked number one and number four in the world but they are the top two players at the Olympics following on from that after of the great european hope and jun ms attorney shuanzhu on launching tin up really high samsonov and comes in next at number seven wouldn't that be a nice story the european elder statesman getting up any chance at sense not winning the olympic fellows wouldn't be going and betting too much on a fair jeffrey no no so just rounding out the top 10 joonyoung's sick from korea Marco's Freitas from Portugal number 9 and then here's another one Timo Boll number 10 yes zero again that would be you know wonderful story for European mobile could get up a win yes it would be wonderful for Europe but you know the strength is really at the top there my long zhuangji cur it's hard it's hard to go past that yes interesting now um did any other players stand out for you I mean what else opposed a joon-young suit from Korea number eight now that's an impressive for him he's really rising up one to look out for yeah we saw him at the Australian Open last year and saw how good he was but you know at the time didn't think wow I was going to be a top ten in the world player so yeah this is this is pretty impressive so now he's currently ranked number ten in the world but for the Olympics goes in number eight so you know he's seated to make the quarter-final that's that's pretty big stuff by joon-young sec yep and then jonas panagiotis I never pronounce his name correctly that's going to be crowd-pleaser yeah Jonas in there at number 19 seed according to this par Gorrell at number 22 one of our favorites and then you know goes down this and Torey Ola a former Commonwealth Games singles champion in at 54 and what are these yeah the Aussies are in there's a David Powell in at 66 Christian in at 68 and then the u.s. players in there as well Kanak jar and Yujin Feng at 64 and 65 so they're not tipped to win let me tell you okay and then one other group players like point out have done really well recently and just you know long outsiders but the English alloys ah yes the English players we saw how great they were at the World Championships let me just see where they've come in so liam Pitchford in number 33 and Paul drink'll in at number 38 so the fair way down the list but we saw their exploits at the world team's championships it would be an interesting draw soon to see who pops them early in the draw absolutely yeah people will not want to be coming up in third player but no failure alright let's look at the women's alloys who has out the top 10 for the women well probably the surprising thing here is that China isn't top – so dinging as you said earlier is the number one seed but think Chen way from Singapore in number 2 seed Li Zhao Jie at number 3 so yeah that that is interesting for me and it does really make you question their decision about who they're selected for the world yeah exactly so you know I mean yeah initially when sitting at home would definitely have been the top seed so there you go and anyway I think you know ding ding leisure year probably favourite still thing Chen Wei is is good but I think that you know in the big big stage of the Olympics I don't I can't see her getting up so the other players that round out the top-10 so Japan really strong there with Kazumi Ishikawa and I put Katara at number 4 and 5 hanging from Germany at number 6 Jun Jie he from Korea and 7 Chen eaching from Taipei number 8 you menu from Singapore's and the other Singapore player in at number 9 at number 10 here we go Patricia solía from Germany so so two Germans in the top 10 – Japanese in the top 10 – Chinese Taipei and there we go so it's interesting they're team the women's game more dominated by the Asian countries that top ten and even you know Germany hanging yeah absolutely Asian origin yeah and it's it always seems to be the way that I mean China has been really unbeatable at at the top for a very very long time you know in the men's you know Sweden had a bit of a go at up top and there are a few other European countries would challenge the Chinese for a while but in the women's they just they have to explain number one there we go alright so yeah that is the list there will be an official version coming out when is that Oh on the first of August is the official ranking list that they will use but basically this is it yeah okay for everybody starting excited the Olympics very close now it's now time for the questions and remember that you can ask your own table tennis question using the ask the coach section of the painting skills website first question is from Xavier Ellis he says every time I cry and you the skinny serve it bounces off you know what's more experienced players look like they're doing the same return and they just touch it back on the net what is going on and what can save you do to get better yeah Xavier is a pretty new player I've just gone down to a club something that we really covered earlier in the show and yeah Xavier just needs to understand firstly what's happening to the ball and then to be able to use his right bat like a rudder to just steer that ball back so whatever spins on the ball just changing the angle of the bat to get the ball back so if there's topspin need to go over if there's backspin need to come under if their side's been kicking off that way then I need to turn my bat the opposite direction and vice versa so so just understanding those basic principles of how you return spin is really crucial yeah and so if you try at the tip of the week feed you can get one of those servers to serve you the exact same serve ten times and just keep making adjustments so you eventually get it back on the table now Carlos has asked us a very interesting question how do you return Timo Boll serve well the first thing you need to do Carlos is get onto a plane get to Germany and see if you can get him to serve to you but let's have a look at perhaps my t-mobile serve all it is it's just a pendulum serve obviously Timo Boll doesn't very very well so he can keep that ball short he can vary the spin on it a lot but it is a basic pendulum serve we've got a lot of lessons on the site about the pendulum serve we've got a lot of discussion on the ask the coach page as well about the pendulum serve see if you can access any of that information and that will give you a really good start as to how to return the pendulum serve the basics is the same as any other serving that you're trying to return it's understanding the type of spin on the ball and then changing the angle of your bat like a rudder to be able to counteract the spin on that ball so I'm just trying to watch what sort of spin he's putting on the ball and then return it as necessary so here I can see a little bit of side spin on the ball so I try and just flick it back there a bit of backspin so I come and push it back so it's really about watching the contact there is hit the ball bit of topspin so I come over the ball so you just start to watch the contact see what spinny is putting on the ball a little bit of backspin and sidespin so I'm going to push it so they're the main things watch the contact keep focused on the ball and then adjust your return as necessary next up is a question from Tasha who wants to know what is options are when someone serves short with side spin to shop because we're talking about a pure side spin serve we do have a few options now you can flick the ball because of the side spin and you can also just push the ball short the third option you've got is to push the ball long so there are quite a few options when they're serving with short side spin so the flick short push or the long push okay Alice Oh when would you that short force as opposed to the long force or the flip it really depends on what type of ball you want next so if you want an open rally then you're going to make more flicks and rolling the ball over because then your opponent is going to play an open ball or a topspin ball or a counter hit at you but if you want a backspin ball coming to you and if you like that ball then it's best to play the ball short or if you don't like the your opponent attacking at you then it's much much better to play the ball short now personally I find off that size then serve it easier to control it if you're playing the flick how do you put the backspin on it but not have the ball pop up high yep so the first thing is have really soft relaxed hand to absorb the speed and then your stroke needs to be more down more vertical you don't need to push that ball forward because the ball will fly a bit long so just come down on the ball really softly and you'll be able to control that ball short it's not easy to start off with but it's it's um it's something you can definitely practice okay makes a lot of sense we'll shake it out there try those three different options see which works best for you but they're your option so yeah flick it push it short or push it long next question is from Josh Nathan who wants to know is the banana flick effective against all types of search he's seen that alloys at the top level players are using it all the time yeah well it almost is usable against any type of short serve but let's just show you a little bit about how you can adjust your banana flick to get that ball on the table against different spins so one of the most important things with the back hand banana flick is to get your elbow forward so you've got room to swing it through the ball otherwise you need it cramped up and I'll be able to make a proper stroke so give yourself room to flick the ball so let's take a look at the backhand side and flick against different types of spins first against the topspin you don't really need to use it because it's already got topspin so it's kind of easy just to flick it normally but adding that side spin is a good variation till you come around the side of the ball gets inside spin on it and it's just a different view for your opponent with asides men serve it's similar you can kind of flick it normally not a good example you can flick it normally though because it has got the side spin so it's not going to go down off your bat so you still got a good angle on to the table and the same thing if you come around the side of it just gives a bit of a different ball for your opponent to look out so it's a good variation to have where it really comes in effect is the backspin because the backspin is going to hit your bat and go down so that's a hard ball to attack but with the with the side spin you're going to negate that by coming around the side of the ball and that way the backspin doesn't affect as much you can get a bit of dip you can get a bit of curve and it's hard for your opponent so that's the real power of the backhand sidespin flick next up is a question from Mars who wants to know how do I return no spencer's he's having trouble cuz he often just returns them hi these opponents messes them away it sounds very similar to the question of returning so it's been says Alice yeah it is really similar so the only real differences are now you don't have to worry about the ball spinning sideways so the ball has no spin so you can just come through and flick the ball and that's probably the best option but you can also still do the short push return or the long push return so you do have those options the short push return can be quite quite tricky what you need to do is come down on the ball and the hardest part is because there's no spin on the ball you need to generate just a little bit of backspin on it just to keep that ball more difficult for the server if you just push it back easily then the server knows that they've served no spin serve you're doing that they may come in and and crunch that next ball so it's you've really got to keep that ball nice and tight nice and low and see if you can just add a little bit of backspin yourself on the ball to make it a bit harder for the server sounds good can you show us some demonstrations sure will so with the no spin ball the ball tends to come through quite slowly as well so you do need to generate some speed let's have a look at the no spin and my flick so I really need to come forward and to generate that speed and as we know with the flick one of the real keys is to get that wrist back at the start so the other option we talked about is the short push now with this one as you can see it's really difficult to keep it nice and low that one would have popped up a little bit too high and Jeff would have been able to come in and play that quite strong I really need to come down on that ball a lot and that's starting to generate a little bit more backspin and now we're trying to start and get that ball a little bit lower as well so keeping it low and adding a little bit of backspin yourself by brushing down on the ball is good and then the third option is a the long push similar to our previous question about the side spin so yeah you have got that option as well but again you need to generate all the spin yourself because the ball is just sitting there and floating at you the next question is from Erin who wants to know how to return a chest high backhand ball he says not high enough to smash and it's really awkward for him Erin the key with that height of a ball is as you said it probably isn't quite high enough to be able to smash so what you need to do is you need to generate topspin now topspin is the thing that helps the ball to drag down onto the table if you don't put topspin on the ball then the ball is going to end up sailing off the end of the table so so let's just have a look so we're really trying to come up and over the top of that ball to generate topspin still even the ball was up quite high so that's what you really need to be doing generating topspin with a good backhand swing when the ball is up higher you don't need to start too low you can start with your bat up a little bit higher and come more forward and over the top of the ball and as part of a new segment this week we're going to talk about some of the mail we receive from you guys after watching last week's show alloys we've got a bit of feedback from last show um Sean gave us some great tips on wearing clothes yes exactly so we we talked a lot in the last show about you know getting to a new club and what you need to do so what Sean mentioned was don't wear a white shirt and that's a really good tip because the white ball white shirt so in in clubs or in tournament you're not allowed to wear the and a white shirt if they're playing with a white ball yeah it actually season allowed to wear the same color shirt as the ball yeah so so yeah just avoid wearing white shirts as a good tip well done Sean thank you and any another good point yeah so he also said you know go there with a really positive attitude and don't be scared to ask questions e yeah he wanted he wanted you to be a little bit more real progressive or you know just just out there a little bit more but also really listen to what the other people say yeah so going to sit around and wait for someone ask you to hit go on ask them for a hit and if you're playing hit someone better you sure that you're enthusiastic they're the main city had yes so gene also talked about that as well so he said relating to Shawn's remarks about not being shy and waiting for other people to invite you to playing and they might do it a couple of times initially to be polite but it's not the common practice show your motivation ask them to play with you and if you're just beginning and fear that they will not enjoy or find it interesting for them to play with you show them that you were serious about learning so you know players do like to help other players and like to see that reaction you know so if you are appreciated of someone helping you or hitting with you just then just show that to them as well and that's that's really good by Jean yeah thanks Jane good advice some other tips about the show for us so just the music was a little bit loud we want to hear and Jeff's graceful tones over it faithful and fit yeah mostly people display my voice so gracefully I'll check with your wife so yeah so that was the only other team energon he he liked you a little advice at the end about the disco dancing too if you haven't seen the end to go to the end of the show last week and Alice got some tips cuz he's quite the disco dancer really good all right everyone well that wraps up another show thanks everyone for watching as always give us feedback love to hear your thoughts and I hope you enjoyed it and thank you Alice thanks Geoffrey we'll see you next time remember if you want your table tennis question answered head over to pingskills calm and use the ask the coach section of the website who knows your question might even get featured on the show the music for today's show is from YouTube's audio library and the song was called Baylor me cumbia talking the aloes recently about you disco dancing and he said that the club he goes to a lot of 80 year old they're just dancing away listen some of those 80 year olds better dancers than you and not for some 80 year olds a lot of a year old if you can beat or Club and seeing some of those wily old characters [Applause] thanks again for watching and we'll be back next week with another show until then keep enjoying your table tennis

38 Replies to “Spin in Table Tennis #271 | PingSkills”

  1. I’m just starting lol – I cant even get it over the net – and yet I’m watching one of the hardest things to learn XD

  2. Can you please advise me the rubbers I should use to generate more spin. I am using stiga classic offensive unstrung blade.

  3. Excuse me if I'm wrong but it seem that to return a serve with spin is not just an angle adjustment thing but it includes a bit of force, angle, and some kind of motion to kill of the received spin.

  4. @0.15 when I played this shot.. my friends argued with me that I lost the point as the ball didn't come from the top of the net!!

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